In response to my post, “Why Kids + Food = Conversational Hot Potato,” a parent wrote in:
We as parents are responsible for teaching our children healthy eating habits and how to think critically about their food consumption. I didn’t realize that my kids were getting these messages from me until my daughter announced at a buffet that she only chose ‘healthy’ foods this time, because she had consumed some ‘unhealthy’ foods in the days prior. She was FOUR at the time! She had chosen some chicken, veggies, and fruit as her meal options. There was a plethora of pastries, cookies, brownies, fried foods, creamy sauce drenched pastas, and veggies, but she chose the healthier options. She used to ask me, “Mommy is this healthy?” when she was curious about a specific food. I had inadvertently taught my kids to think about what they were putting in their mouths on a daily basis . . . . Reminding them that they had consumed some less healthy options and maybe they should stick with the healthier options for a while.
But after reading this comment, another parent was worried:
Oh, this made me cringe a little bit. I know the rest of the story is a good thing – who could criticize a parent for inculcating their young child with a respect for balance and nutrition, after all. But part of me looks down the road and wonders if the healthy/unhealthy awareness sets the stage for an eating disorder, for a child who tries to diet in kindergarten?
When my husband makes comments about the need to eat better following a couple of bad days, I discourage him from doing so in front of our daughter for fear that she’ll begin to parrot his rationale. What I want for her instead is just to love good, healthy food, not in opposition to the tasty, unhealthy stuff, but for its own sake.
This second comment got me thinking. As regular Lunch Tray readers know, my husband and I are serious chow-hounds, the kind of people who will go far out of our way for some intriguing food item we’ve read about. E.g., on a recent family trip, I made sure that we included a stop in Portland , OR for no other reason than I wanted to track down a particular Bosnian sandwich cart I’d heard about, and to go to a Thai restaurant that’s legendary. (Both awesome, BTW.) But when we got back from our vacation — which included all sorts of other delicious but not-so-healthy indulgences — I heard myself telling my family, OK, now we really have to eat more healthfully to make up for the prior two weeks.
Was that a bad message? Even though I never use the terms “good” food and “bad” food, am I nonetheless creating a troubling dichotomy between “yummy” food and the dreaded “healthy” food? Or do kids need to understand that you can’t eat as we did on our vacation — nothing but restaurant meals and daily (or twice-daily) desserts — without then scaling back with home-cooked meals (tasty, I hope, but certainly more healthful than most restaurant meals) and fewer sugary indulgences?
Am I making them crazy, or am I just giving them the necessary tools for a balanced eating life? Do you sometimes fear you’re creating too much of a distinction between “good” and “bad” food with your kids? Let me hear what you have to say.
[Ed. update: Well, it turned out that Lunch Tray readers had a LOT to say about this topic. After you read the comments below, check out this follow-up post.]
Copyright secured by Digiprove © 2011 Bettina Elias Siegel
{ 41 comments… read them below or add one }
I struggle with this one as well. Are we just putting lipstick on the proverbial pig when we mask our own food neuroses with ‘good’ and ‘bad’ food language?
I honestly do not know where this will end up. I can only hope that, as with any ‘successful’ parenting technique, that our children will learn what we want them to by modeling our behavior. That means that my daughter may see me indulge one day (or two!), and then see me eating a full, healthy meal for the next couple of days. She does not hear me complain or berate myself, nor will she see me fast, purge or binge exercise (which I do not do anyway). It is about teaching our children self-control, but not self-denial.
Lindsey – agreed. What we do is probably far more important than anything we say. (Don’t you hate that about parenting?) I will sometimes eat dessert — even when I’m not dying for it and/or the jeans are feeling tight — just because I don’t want my daughter to feel that deprivation is necessary. Is that in itself crazy???
Yes, it is a little crazy! You have your reasons for not wanting dessert. What is wrong with just taking a bite, with the explanation “I am not hungry, but I just want a taste.” What a great opportunity to demonstrate moderation! Eat when you are hungry, not when you are full………
That entry did sit a little wrong with me. The idea that high calorie foods can’t be “healthy” was upsetting to me. For some segments of our society, high-calorie foods are the healthiest foods that one can eat. Active, healthy children should be consuming high-calorie foods. Not uber-processed fast foods or Lunchables, but things like natural peanut butter, avocadoes, whole milk, etc.
I’m reminded of a term that I recently heard, “Muesli Belt Malnutrition,” which was (according to Wikipedia) coined by Prof. Vincent Marks. It’s a theory (which apparently has proved pretty controversial) that parents who feed their kids a diet of high-fiber, low-fat food that may very well be “healthy” for adults could seriously be depriving their kids of important nutrients, including fat necessary for development.
I don’t think that any parent wants their kid to eat nothing but cake for dinner, but a serving of macaroni and cheese or Fettuccine Alfredo served next to some vegetables and/or fruit, and maybe with some lean chicken or fish as well, is not an unhealthy meal for a growing child. In fact, I’m not convinced that it’s an unhealthy meal for an active adult, especially if it’s made at home in an environment where you control the amount of sodium that goes into the food, where you know it doesn’t contain artificial ingredients you can’t pronounce, etc.
At my house, hamburgers are made with grass-fed beef, served on whole-wheat buns, and have mashed sweet potatoes and broccoli on the side, not french fries. I do make breaded fried chicken breasts (with whole wheat breadcrumbs, cooked in olive or canola oil) served alongside a low-fat pasta or rice dish with vegetables and a salad with more vegetables. I believe that red meat and fried foods can be part of a healthy diet when eaten with otherwise healthy foods and accompanied by a healthy level of activity.
NotCinderll:
I think you and I are on the same page when it comes to home cooking. I definitely feed my kids cheese, butter, peanut butter, avocados, the occasional fried item like fish, etc., all as part of a balanced diet. And I do worry about parents who are severely restricting their children’s fat intake — unless, of course, there is a lot of fat consumption going on outside the home or some medical issue that dictates it.
But food outside the home is a whole different story. Restaurants are notoriously free with fat and sodium and we’ve already talked on this site about the huge amount of sweet and salty processed treats to which our kids have access at school, at sports events, etc. So when you take into account how much of that stuff your kid is eating, then you might feel like scaling back a little at home is needed.
My main message to my kids is: I love all types of food and there’s no “good” or “bad” food, but some food is better for our bodies, some less good, and we have to try to strike a balance.
What do you think?
As long as they don’t walk away with the impression that rich foods belong nowhere in any quantity in “healthy” diets.
I, too, had an immediate reaction of a wince/cringe variety when I read that first comment about the young child selecting “healthy” items and apparently restricting some of her choices based on that information. I don’t really think brownies, for instance, are actually unhealthy; they’re simply something a person should eat less of than things like fruits and vegetables. I hate the notion of categorizing foods in such a strict way. Homemade pie, for instance, is one of the most wonderful things a person can ever have in life. You just shouldn’t subsist on it.
I also quite agree with Michael Pollan’s food rule that you can indulge in all the treats you want, IF those treats are homemade. (I think the rule is actually that you make things yourself, but since we’re talking about children here, I’ll say that it still works if Mom or Dad or Grandma make those treats.) And no, a pre-made pie crust or a cake mix with pudding mix added do not count.
It’s unfortunate that a quick blurb or paragraph can give some people the impression that I may be setting my daughter up for an eating disorder. And I understand that it could look that way according to what I said. So to clarify, my intent was to convey that from a young age both my kids were taught to be conscious of what they put in their mouths. I’ve never restricted their diets in any way, or my own for that matter. I’ve never been on a ‘diet.’ On the occasions that my daughter would choose the healthy options I never told her she couldn’t have something else. Food is just never an ‘issue’ in our house. It makes me think of the time she was about 3 and for an entire week all she would eat is cantaloupe. True, it’s a healthy option and better than cupcakes and such, but a few people, including my husband, were concerned. “Aren’t you going to try and make her eat something else?” I always answered no, there must be something in it that her body needs, she won’t starve to death, and it’s not like she’ll be eating only cantaloupe for the rest of her life. The last thing I was going to do was try and force her to eat something else. I offered other options, along with my one bite rule, but if she didn’t comply with the one bite rule, I DID NOT force it. Within a week she was back to her regular, well-rounded diet.
I’ve always been about eating ‘clean food’, meaning home cooked meals, homemade cookies, cakes and pastries, homemade sauces, dressings and dips. I’ve cooked professionally in restaurants and as a caterer and it’s one of my true passions in life. Friends and family members remark that they don’t know how we as a family stay thin and healthy with all that I feed them. I always say we just avoid packaged/processed foods, artificial ingredients, fast food, etc. most of the time. We try our best to eat organic and sustainable, and we love maintaining our own garden to supplement our diets, we visit the farmer’s market regularly, and I have an organic produce delivery service. We eat a wide variety of ingredients, including fat laden options, red meat, pork, fried foods, cheese, etc. It’s all about balance and moderation. We have a running joke in the family–If you were stranded on a desert island and you could choose 2 foods you couldn’t live without, what would they be? My answer has always been cheese and chocolate chip cookies. Each family memeber always seems to choose cheese as one of the options. Last week I made 4 batches of apricot cream puffs and chocolate eclairs with Bavarian cream filling so my family would have something sweet to take on a road trip, and I would have something to indulge in while they were gone! But all the options are what I call ‘clean.’ Real food. Plain and simple. The dinner table has never been a place for issues and ‘battle,’ as I’ve stated in other posts here. I’ve never restricted the kids or myself so there have never been feelings of deprivation and a need to overindulge as I’ve seen other kids do when they’re exposed to sweet treats.
I was on a cruise once and I saw a little girl of about 8 at the buffet loading her plate with bacon. Nothing but bacon. Twelve to 15 strips. She was told she was on vacation so she could get whatever she wanted, and she did. Does she get bacon at home? Probably. Does she get it as much as she wants? Probably not. Do her parents tell her ‘no’ most of the time she wants it or something else they deem ‘bad’ for her, or wants more of it? Probably. Now it has become the forbidden fruit. I see her growing up and loading her freezer with bacon, thinking, “I never got enough of this as a kid and now I can eat all I want, and I will! HA!”
I’ve had kids come to the house for a birthday party who are not allowed chocolate or soda. They’re always the ones who have the chocolate smeared across their face and who’ve been guzzling soda all day long. They’re the kids who have gone home and puked or had an upset stomach for the rest of the day. They’re exposed to something they can rarely have and figure they better consume as much of it as possible while they have a chance. There’s a certain obsession they seem to have about it. THAT is a food issue or eating disorder in the making.
Both my kids have grown to be knowledgeable about food, and conscious about what they consume and where it came from. I’ve never told them they couldn’t have something, just taught them how to make healthy, BALANCED choices. Of course they eat some processed items, some fast food (very rarely), or sometimes regret something they ate because it made them feel crappy. But it’s always been their choice. They prefer to eat healthy, clean options, and they’re like this because I’ve educated them about food and then gave them the freedom to make choices based on that education. It’s never been about weight, only overall health and balance, and eating for pleasure.
My daughter is soon to be 17, bakes cakes and cookies, and cooks meals regularly. She’s always picking my brain about how to make this and that. She eats whatever she wants, whenever she wants, and is bothered that a few of her girlfriends are on diets and seem to be food obsessed at times. My son will be 22 in a couple of weeks. He’s probably the most organic eater in our family. He works for a sustainable restaurant, will not eat commercially raised chicken, and is even wary of some suppliers who say they have free range birds because some truly are not free range. He helps his friend run a small business which produces organic hummus and supplies to a few Whole Foods markets in our area. He loves to come home and visit because he gets to eat ‘mom’s cooking’ which he misses, and he gets to cook in a large, well-stocked kitchen. Neither of my kids have ever had food issues, weight issues, eating disorders, or health problems related to their diets. They eat a wide variety of foods, explore international cuisine (My daughter’s cookbook collection is starting to rival mine) and know how to listen to their bodies and feed it what it needs. They also know it’s okay to indulge in foods that many deem unhealthy, but they know they can because they have a healthy balance.
Sorry for the long post, but food is something I’m very passionate about–avoiding food issues, avoiding eating disorders, knowing how to stay healthy and balanced without restriction, eating sustainably and organic, and having food be important because it is part of life, health, family, celebration, and pure joy. Food should never be used as a manipulation tool, within a power struggle, as a ‘medication’ for depression, as a reward for good behavior, etc. THAT is how eating disorders and food issues are formed. My kids are living proof that I taught them well and had food and nutrition incorporated into our lives in a healthy manner. I’ve spent all of their lives avoiding the development of food issues and eating disorders, and I’ve been successful. So when someone reads what I wrote and becomes ‘concerned’ I feel the need to defend myself and prove that what I’ve done and how I’ve done it was the “right” thing for me and my family. One small post can’t explain a lifetime of teaching, eating and attitudes about food, hence the long post here to give others a better understanding. I’ve done SOMETHING right! Like I said, my kids are living proof.
We ration bacon at home too… but it’s not because bacon is bad, it’s because it’s yummy and expensive and we have a lot of people to feed. If you don’t know why bacon is limited in this girl’s house, you shouldn’t assume.
Funny, as I re-read my initial post I noticed I never used the words “good” and “bad” and the one time I used the word “unhealthy” I put it in quotes, meaning those are not my words and attitude about those particular options, and my daughter used the word ‘unhealthy’ because she was FOUR at the time. It’s what others label it to be. And those opposed to what I had to say have been the ones who used “good” and “bad” labels and assumed that I taught my daughter what “unhealthy” options are. If you read it again you will see that when I’m referring to foods in question I use the words and terms “healthier,” “healthier options,” and “less healthy options.” If foods are clean, homemade, chemical free, and preferably organic, I deem it to be healthy and worth eating. Desserts, sweets, fats, cheese, red meat and all. All of you are the ones who put good and bad labels on these foods. This is NOT what I’ve taught my kids for the past 20+ years. Peace~
Lenee, I think we’re coming down to a semantic argument. You’re saying again that there are “healthy” and “unhealthy” options, implying that low-fat, low-calorie are “healthy,” while high-fat and high-calorie (like pasta with creamy sauce, as you mentioned in your first entry) are “unhealthy.”
Cantaloupe is often a healthy choice as a dessert or side dish for people such as ourselves who live in an affluent society and probably get way too much in the way of fat, starch, and sugar and too little in the way of antioxidants and fiber. However, if given the choice between subsisting on nothing but cantaloupe for a year versus subsisting on nothing but cupcakes for a year, the cantaloupe eater would have much less of a chance of survival than the cupcake eater. For a famine victim who is underweight, cupcakes would likely be easier to digest than the cantaloupe (especially if made with white flour!) Cantaloupe is not empirically healthier than cupcakes. It’s only healthier for people who are getting too much of what’s in the cupcakes and not enough of what’s in the cantaloupe.
It’s great that you taught your kids not to subsist on deep fried, chemical-laden, sugar and sodium heavy foods. It’s only the loaded language that I have an issue with.
I am not the one who used the language and semantics referring to unhealthy options. I used the words and terms “healthy,” “healthier options,” and “less healthy options.” I never said the creamy sauces and and pasta were unhealthy options. Just what my daughter chose at the time were HEALTHIER than the latter. Yes, I guess it is an issue of semantics and misinterpretation. And my mention of the cantaloupe incident is only to prove a point that food is not, and has never been, an issue for my family. We are not part of a society that is starving and would have to worry about choosing between cupcakes and cantaloupe. My post, as I pointed out before, was taken out of context and the message was lost because it was removed from all that surrounded it. I also need to remind you that I was not the one who inserted the “loaded language.” You say I implied that pasta with creamy sauce is unhealthy, when in fact I said my daughter chose a “healthier option.” I never said, nor did I imply that the pasta was unhealthy. Just that it wasn’t AS healthy as chicken, fruit, and veggies. And since we have the choice within our society to choose among those options, the claim that a cupcake is a better choice than cantaloupe for one who is trying not to starve to death is a bit of an unrealistic argument to prove a point. True, the cupcake may be better, but within this context, it does not apply. If the whole, original post was read, maybe my point would have gotten across without an attack on semantics and so called ‘loaded language.’ I could go over everyone’s posts and pick them apart and twist the words, pull bits and pieces out and tear them apart and make assumptions about the overall message. But I don’t because I realize that there is more to the message than what one paragraph, sentence, or word may convey. One must read a post in it’s whole before they pass judgment on one segment of it. THAT was my beef with people picking apart my words. The rest of the original post is referring to education, moderation, and lack of issues and restriction when it comes to food. I never deemed anything as unhealthy, hence my mention of putting the word unhealthy in quotes the ONE time I mentioned it. If all of my posts are going to subject to being picked apart because of semantics and the true message is lost, I will second guess replying again, and I wonder how others will respond to me trying to pull the same stunts if I decide to pick apart every word or phrase mentioned without taking into consideration what context the word or phrase was used, or the point that was trying to be made. I’m also not a fan of others making assumptions, especially when one says I said or implied something, when clearly I didn’t. Again, read what was written and realize that any loaded language was inserted by others, and implications were based on assumptions.
How is pasta in a creamy sauce less healthy than plain grilled chicken? The pasta has more fiber and more calcium. What it has less of are fat and calories. You’re calling foods “healthy” when you mean “not fattening,” and “less healthy” when you mean “fattening.” There’s more to health than fat content.
Lenne,
I totally agree… I can only hope that I can serve my daughter as well as you have served yours. Thank you for replying.
Thank you, Stephanie, for actually reading what was written and taking the time to absorb the message I was trying to convey. Just the fact that you are here and you care about food tells me that you are serving your daughter well!
I got your message Lenee as well. It didn’t make me cringe. If you think about it, what words WOULD you use other than healthy and unhealthy to teach your kids? I think there is something inherently wrong with labeling any food “good” or “bad”. THAT creates a hotbed for eating disorders. As well as (someone mentioned) deprivation.
My mom was ahead of her time and allowed us NO, NONE, NADA sugar or junk food. I got my first job at 15 and a year of paychecks went directly to McDonalds. My mom thought I using it for drugs. In a way, I was. So now, even though I’m an organic, hippy granola mom, we occasionally stop at McDonalds. For a burger and a glass of water (my 4 year old has no clue what a Happy Meal is). I want to teach him that moderation, especially with junk is the key.
Like your daughter, my son picks up various foods in the market and asks, “Does this have junk in it?” I define junk as high fructose corn syrup, hydrogenated oils and any fake sweetener. He never asks if fruit or veggies have junk in it. He knows junk exists in package foods.
We live on high fat. Avocados, olive oil by the gallon, full fat raw milk right from the farm, tons of hard cheeses, etc. I should mention that we’re both very slim and extremely active.
I guess I don’t have a point here. Having overcome every eating disorder known, this is a passionate subject for me. I feel blessed that I rediscovered the joy of healthful eating and can pass it on to my son. Just wanted to post my 2 cents and say I think you’re doing a great job.
Jamie
As the author of the second comment above, I do want to apologize to Lenee. When I read your initial comment, not for one moment did I believe that you were setting your child up for an eating disorder. I tried to say that twice in my own comment in order to make that clear.
My husband and I are currently struggling to put a few extra pounds on our 18 month old who is far too small for her age. We’ve been instructed by the nutritionist at our local children’s hospital that we need to get out of the habit of having conversations about our daughter’s eating (what she consumes, what she doesn’t) in front of her for just this reason, not to set her up for body image issues. Whether this is a legitimate rationale or not, I don’t know. But it’s something that we’re working on at home, so your comment prompted mine.
Thank you, Jen. And I did see that you were not trying to attack or criticize, and I feel I understood the point you were trying to make.
I responded to Bettina’s email to me by saying this regarding your very respectful post, “And NO! I didn’t feel offended by your post. I understand exactly what you were trying to say, and even Jen’s response to my words was very well thought out and reasonable. Her words were another reason I spoke up. She liked my way of thinking but worried that my daughter might be set up for an eating disorder. So I was also replying to that concern with reassurance that the way I operate would never cause an eating disorder. It’s when others chimed in with their minds made up about what they thought I was saying, and they couldn’t have been further from the truth. ”
So no offense taken, and I appreciated your input! No apology necessary, but I do appreciated your concern
I realized while reading these posts that many of you do what I do, which is to put food in the context of a sliding scale – healthy, healthier, not healthy, vs. a ‘good/bad’ dichotomy. I think this sliding scale empowers our children to make their own decision and encourages them to reflect on what they ate, as well as what they will eat. If they occasionally have ‘not healthy’ food, they will be able to balance it out with something in the ‘healthy’ or ‘healthier’ category.
Lindsey, I think this is where you (and Lenee) and I fundamentally disagree. I think that we need to stop using value judgment words and use words that talk about balanced meals and balanced diets. The problem is that children are very literal-minded folk, and if you say that certain foods are “healthier” than others, then a child who wants to be really good and has a very literal brain will decide that the best way to eat is only to eat all the “healthiest” foods. If “healthiest” is only reserved for fruits, vegetables, and plain, unadorned lean meats, this could contribute to orthorexia, if not a more serious disorder.
I’m referring above to “less healthy” as applied to nutritious but high-fat foods like homemade fried chicken or mac & cheese made with real cheddar. I’m not referring to the ersatz non-food processed crap that Bettina mentions in her latest blog post.
Again, you miss the point. Even with everyone pointing out that they understand what I was trying to convey, you don’t see it. My whole point and the posts involved discuss a BALANCED approach, and NOT labeling anything unhealthy. Funny that many others do see this, but for some reason you don’t, or don’t want to.
BTW….I have a degree in Psychology with an emphasis in child development. I understand to a degree limited to my education and experience about how a child’s mind works and that they are literal thinkers up to a certain age. How I raised my kids and communicated with them did not create food issues or eating disorders. My point is, and has always been, how my kids live and eat now is living proof that I did SOMETHING right. They are not little kids anymore and actually choose how and what they eat, based on what I taught them. I regularly make homemade mac and cheese, fried chicken and we deem it good, healthy food within our family. I recently was able to recreate a restaurant dish that my husband and I love from a restaurant we used to frequent before we moved. We miss it so I played in the kitchen until I recreated it. It includes a fettuccine with alfredo sauce, topped with a grilled orange roughy fillet topped with and orange cream sauce. As pointed out by Jamie below, my daughter at the young age of 4 knew that a HEALTHIER option from a buffet in a RESTAURANT would be chicken, veggies, and fruit. Again, that was my point. It doesn’t mean she labels cheese and sausage lasagna, or fried chicken, or fettuccine alfredo I make in my kitchen is unhealthy. And again, I used the terms “healthy,” “healthier options,” and “less healthy.” Again, it’s an argument of semantics and if you choose to pick apart an excerpt without paying attention to the whole message, you need to expect a debate and defense against your analysis.
YES! You get what I was saying! THANK YOU Lindsey!
I think it’s only fair to remind you that Lenee originally wrote about a buffet. I doubt the creamy pasta was the homemade variety you’re talking about. It was probably laden with MSG and other additives, not too mention being in the open air for god knows how long (and I sincerely doubt there was an ounce of real cheddar). I think the point was given a choice, her daughter knew to make healthier choices. I don’t recall seeing a break down of fattening=unhealthy.
I’m not trying to stir up any s**t here…but I am truly curious (mostly addressed to NotCinderell)…how do you distinguish with your children? I use words like unhealthy, junk and positive words like whole foods and nutritious. Ideally, my son would eat only whole, delicious foods in my home…we know that’s not the reality.
How do you teach your children about the difference? Do you ever go to a fast food place? How do you explain why we don’t eat ice cream and Mickey Ds everynight? Or why some kids eat white bread at lunch? I’m trying to wrap my head around other ways to word it in a teaching context, especially in terms suitable for a 4 year old (I’ve run the course on “because I said so and I’m the mommy). I agree: good vs. bad is awful. But why is unhealthy vs. healthy so bad?
Again, I’m not being confrontational, just sincerely curious.
My oldest is 3 1/2, but I’d probably say something like Bettina mentioned in her follow-up post, about “It’s not good for you to eat too much of that” or “we only eat that when we eat vegetables, too” or “we don’t eat that very often.”
If you re-read the original post you will see that we are actually on the same page regarding this. I say, “my daughter announced at a buffet that she only chose ‘healthy’ foods this time, because she had consumed some ‘unhealthy’ foods in the days prior.” Unhealthy in quotes because they were not my words, and my daughter was only 4 and used the word unhealthy. Clarification of the words and my attitudes came with time and maturity.
I also say, “Reminding them that they had consumed some less healthy options and maybe they should stick with the healthier options for a while.” Again, an emphasis on balance, not restriction. No quotes used because these are my words.
I have no problem with your children’s diet, Lenee. It’s only the issue of labeling foods “healthy,” “less healthy” and “healthier” that I have a problem with, and your continuing reiteration of the same point over and over is not going to change my mind.
My reiteration in my last post was to only point out that we seem to be on the same page regarding balance and moderation. We must use some sort of language to explain why. Clarification of that language comes with age and maturity of the children you’re speaking to so they have a full understanding of what the meaning is behind the language. What you say when their 3 is not the be all/end all of the discussion. It’s a constant dialogue throughout their lives. There’s nothing wrong with how you speak to your kids about food, and there was nothing wrong with how I spoke to my kids about food using the labels I did, because, in the end, they got it. That was the ultimate goal. You didn’t seem to understand the point I was trying to make based on your responses. That’s why I felt the need to reiterate.
I understand. I just disagree. I think that using the wrong words can be damaging, even with further clarification.
Those “wrong” words worked for me for 22 years.
@ Not Cinderell:
Again, just curious and maybe you’re not there yet: My four year old just started: WHY?
Why don’t we eat too much of that?
Why can’t we have ice cream for dinner?
Why do we have to eat vegetables when we eat that?
What would you say then?
I’ve actually introduced the notion of protein ratio: to carb ratio: to fat ratio. Probably mostly lost on a four year old but it’s fact.
Wondering what you say to the why?
I’m okay with saying “it’s not healthy to eat too much of that…” rather than “that food is healthier than this food.” Because eating an imbalanced diet is, certainly, unhealthy. It was just the vilifying of certain fattening but nutritious foods as “unhealthy” that sat wrong with me. (The example of the OP being “pasta with creamy sauce.”)
Oh, for goodness’ sake. Twinkies are bad. Yeah, I said it, and here’s another news flash: fried Twinkies are extremely *unhealthy.* Ask my kids (7 and 6, boys) why. They will explain on a level commensurate with their respective ages. At least, I think they will. If not, then my job is not yet done.
Don’t misunderstand. I can understand the merits of Critical Nutritional Relativist Theory. I was one of those kids who pined after Count Chocula and BooBerry cereals, argued (unsuccessfully) for a Quarter Pounder with Cheese (“but Mom, I’m NINE now”), and looked for the candy dish in the homes of my grandparents’ contemporaries time and time again. (That is, until I realized that the white meltaway mints with visible green filling never *ever* seemed to change and only clumped together in alarmingly greater numbers with each visit.) Part of the fun of watching Charlie Brown specials on television was checking out all that Dolly Madison “goodness” (with sprinkles now – dang)! Once “grown,” I, too, hit McDonald’s and its ilk hard. After a childhood of relatively healthful eating, however, I learned that the full-tilt, adult-sized, happiest of meals would leave me feeling sick for three days. Thank God. I still eat there now and then, but I’m the 40 year old ordering a (kid-sized?) cheeseburger. It’s tasty. So is kale-avocado salad, but I’m not fooling myself or them. The Important Thing (my kids might repeat woodenly, perhaps without belief) is that scientists know that some stuff is tasty in a way that zaps your brain and messes with your guts, so you have to be careful even though it’s Totally Tasty. By the time each reaches adolescence, both will reject all I say as a matter of principle so what the hell. (The 6 year old has already decided that soap and water are overrated and he’s “over” baths of any sort. We’re working on this. Should I give up? Is “dirty” a dirty word?) I’ll cross that bridge when the time comes. In the meantime, my (still living) mother’s voice haunts me now when I don’t make my bed *and* I remember marveling at this all through my first years away from home (“How does she DO this?”).
So I conclude with this simple, fire-drawing Statement(s) of Universal Truth: Fried Twinkies are Bad. Disagree with me. Flame away. Knock yourself out. And, yeah, I’ll wager on survival rates against fried Oreos/Twinkies/whathaveyou against an all-cantaloupe diet as soon as I can find the time for such exercises in whimsy. In the meantime, I need my children to understand that reaching for apples instead of [insert any food sold at modern-day carnival here] is just What You Do, as best you can, Today. I’ll never deny to them that the selection of diet is legitimate fodder for critical inquiry. For right now, however, I feel good about the risk/benefit analysis attached to having my children believe that some foods are Bad (or, more accurately, that Mom thinks as much). It’s like Please and Thank You — by the time they learned to question whether and to what extent the words did or did not fully capture their intent at any given time, it was too late. The reflex was there. I accept all blame for this example of indoctrination and hope like the dickens for something similar when it comes to diet. McDonalds doesn’t need any help convincing anyone anywhere that yummytasty is good, good, good (and yours for less than a buck). I accept the challenge to present a clear rationale to the contrary.
P.S. I know from experience that the tone of my statements often reads more harshly than I intend. I can only say that I don’t mean to attack anyone personally; I’m reacting (with insufficient tact, probably) to content with which I disagree. I’m not afraid to attack a Fried Twinkie, but I’m pretty sure that the Twinkie would win.
I love it, Pager! Bring it on! As for the rest of you, any Fried Twinkie defenders out there?
Heh, heh, heh, heh…………Love it……..
I was never arguing in favor of deep fried twinkies.
I’m not sure anyone could, except maybe the people behind the Houston rodeo. We’re all about the fried food on a stick. http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/life/hoffman/6895575.html
THANK YOU PAGER!!! Well said.
Sorry, Lenee, like the others, I didn’t mean to imply that you’re setting your children up for a lifetime of eating disorders. My concern was primarily that children tend to see the world more in terms of black and white than adults, and whenever I have seen children concerned about “healthy” foods, I worry that they are turning away from foods that are necessary for growing bodies (fat, carbohydrates) as well as things that are just plain delightful (pie, brownies). I realize it probably sounded like a criticism of your parenting, which is certainly not what I wanted. Like NotCindarell, my concern is that children in general will hear words like “healthy” or even “healthier” and make those good-bad associations, always opting for fruit, for instance, over ice cream.
Thank you, and I understand what you were trying to say. We all seem to have the same goals, and we all achieve them in different ways. There’s no right or wrong way to do it, as long as you have a life-long, open dialogue about what the language you choose means. That, I believe is the key.
Kids do see in black and white, and that’s why communication needs to be constant and more detailed as their level of understanding expands. Eventually, they get it. I think many expressed concern because they thought I may have “laid down the law” when the kids were little and then left it at that, and my defense was my attempt to explain that that wasn’t the case, because my kids had obviously grown up to have healthy, well-rounded eating habits.
I agree that there are many parents who seem to operate in a manner that creates food issues and eating disorders, and I’ve always tried to be conscious of that in order to avoid it, and the way I did it worked for us. As my daughter and I sat down over bowls of ice cream last night, we discussed what kind of ice cream maker we should invest in, so we could make our own favorite flavors without all the additives, etc. in store bought ice cream! It’s all about balance, and knowing what you’re putting in your mouth………
Peace~
I know my comment is late in the game, but I’m going to jump in here for people (like me) who are new to the blog and catching up on old posts. We don’t talk about healthy or unhealthy options with our kids. When they were really small, we talked about “slow” foods and “go” foods. The concept was that Go foods powered your body up to GO – to be fast and strong and grow the way it should. Slow foods make you feel slow and yucky. We talked a lot about making sure your body gets the Go food it needs first, and then afterwards you can have some Slow foods. As my kids are getting older (6 & 4), we talk more about nutritional components. We don’t buy into the low fat/low calorie ideology. I have taught them that we need fats to grow our brains, protein to grow our muscles, calcium to grow our bones, vitamins to grow our immune systems. It’s not a perfect system, but the kids are starting to think about what kinds of nutrients are in different foods, and about choosing balanced diets. I asked my 4 YO one night what she wanted for dinner one night, and she asked for potatoes and rice. My 6 YO jumped in and reminded her that potatoes and rice were both carbs, so we should probably have a protein instead of the potatoes. That is the kind of balanced thinking that I want my kids to have!
I will admit, I do get a little nutty about “fake foods.” HFCS, unpronounceable chemicals, and food dyes in everything are my major pet peeves. We talk about the chemicals and fake flavors and colors in foods. We are also starting to talk about the ethical issues of the way animals are raised. I think the key here is we talk, we talk, and we talk some more! I take the chances that come up to have input into the way my kids think about food.
For the most part, I am a proponent of Michael Pollan’s ideas… if it’s not something your grandparents would have recognized as food, you probably shouldn’t be eating it; if you are going to eat sweets/treats, make them yourself; eat more plants. Will that create eating disorders? I doubt it.
Sarah: I love when new readers find older posts and keep the conversation going. So first of all, welcome to TLT! And it sounds like you are doing a terrific job in teaching your kids lifelong lessons about food and nutrition. Looking back, I wish I’d started our conversations about food choices in this same way. When my kids were little we really just talked about “treats” versus the things we eat all the time, and it was only later that we started getting into chemicals, etc. I was thinking that this summer we’ll get the junior reader version of Omnivore’s Dilemma and read it together to deepen their understanding of the issues surrounding food and its origins. And just FYI, there’s a nice documentary for kids out there along the same lines called “What’s On Your Plate?” My review is here. Thanks again for taking the time to comment. I hope you’ll stick around and continue to be part of our community.
{ 3 trackbacks }